|
|
| Post Number: 21
|
Octavian 
FNG
Group: Members
Posts: 62
Joined: May 2000
|
 |
Posted on: Jun. 23 2000,17:45 |
|
   |
first of all, i have already voiced my opinion about communism/socialism in the governments thread. namely, that people are too greedy and self-centered for it to work. i think that a republic with a capitalistic base (u.s.) is the best we have so far.the real reason i'm writing is chrissy's comment that in capitalism, you can't advance in status and you stay in whatever class you're born in. i say: bullSHIT. don't even shovel me that EXCUSE that people have been using forever to be lazy. i can think of five close adult friends of mine right now off the top of my head that have been born in poverty or close to it and worked their asses off to get in the places they are today, mostly uppder middle class. about the whole gov't control of factories paragraph, yeah, they tried that. same thing happened that i think will always happen. controllers of gov't only did what was good for them, not for the common man. common man gets poor, hungry, and pissed, and finds a revolutionary figure to follow because he believes that anything must be better than being poor, hungry, and pissed. and no, sqirrels don't sell their nuts. that's just an extra step we've added. the whole concept is just the same: get as much as you can before someone else does. and what is squirrel currency if not nuts? berries? you are amazed that we can't see the differences between the "human" world and the "animal" world. i are amazed that you can't see all the similarities. and i am waiting to hear all of the differences that you keep alluding to. in case you have forgotten, we ARE classified as animals. and i have seen all those examples you gave. the concentration on the cat's face is the exact same i have seen on an opponent's face while playing pickup basketball when he is guarding me. they are both focused on just one thing, and conquering that one thing. i am their prey. they are both hungry for it, and both know only their skill can take care of the task at hand. and have you ever seen a person looking desperately for a job? scurrying about like a certain small mammal with a bushy tail. just looking for a place to get nuts (no pun intended) before they're all taken up and they starve for the winter. and if competition is just human, why do males of every species fight each other like hell every year to get the prize female? i have refuted some of your opinions, but that is just what all of this is, opinions. you have proclaimed your word as the truth a couple of times, and that bothers me. example: Open your mind a little bit- you can see this is true. just remember, just because you say it or hear it doesn't mean it's true. /novel
|
 |
|
|
| Post Number: 22
|
|
|
| Post Number: 23
|
|
|
| Post Number: 24
|
|
|
| Post Number: 25
|
Hellraiser
PH34R M3
Group: Members
Posts: 977
Joined: May 2000
|
|
Posted on: Jun. 23 2000,22:00 |
|
 |
No form of government or lack there of is perfect. We aren't perfect, and we never will be. Different forms of government have been tried at various times, and all wind up falling short of their ideals. You can't get away from that. But unless a better way to implement communism is found, it remains one of the worst solutions while being one of the best in theory. People and governments can't live by theory, they live and die by actual experience, and hopefully they learn from history. In America, we have one of the largest GNP's in the world, one of the lowest unemployment rates, and very few people are starving or homeless. Technology has developed in leaps and bounds over the past 200 years, and continues to do so to date. What is America's success based on? Capitalism and pseudo-Democracy. (America is not, and never has been a democracy. It is rather a slightly modified republic.) All of the attempts to implement communism in the world to date have resulted in oppression, depression, and have instead of raising/lowering everyone to a middle class have lowered almost everyone to the lowest class, and left a few people very high up to run everything. If you can find any concrete evidence that any form of communism has worked, please let me know, I'd be more than happy to read about it.One thing that is not well understood is that our "middle class" here in America is about as well off as the "upper class" in most of the world. We all have nice cars, plenty of food, nice houses, medical coverage, most of us have computers, microwaves, hot and cold running water, all the electricity we could want, and a two week vacation every year. Sure we still have bills, and may find it hard to foot some of them from time to time, but we are not in any way underprivileged. I'd rather see a country be as successfull as we are even if it's based on a shitty form of government than see a country that is based on an ideal form of government where people are as poor as dirt. And Chrissy, I have read the Communist Manifesto. There has yet to be a government set up that follows it to the letter, and in today's world I don't think it would work at all because the world is so different. I personally am not a Republican, a Democrat, a Communist, or belong to any other party. Each has it's good points and its shortcomings. I prefer to stay out of politics because none of the political groups I have seen are all that great. I know I'm rambling a bit here, and I apologize, but it's been like 48 hours since I've slept. Hopefully you'll be able to make some sense of all this.  ------------------
Just your generic meaningless signature. Mix with 2 quarts water and stir till evenly coated.
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 26
|
|
|
| Post Number: 27
|
|
|
| Post Number: 28
|
Firefox
FNG
Group: Members
Posts: 139
Joined: Jun. 2000
|
|
Posted on: Jun. 24 2000,00:27 |
|
|
Kay, my problem is I just can't see how a system like communism can work. I think I've alluded to it before in other posts- we humans are selfish, self-serving beings. How can you look at millions of people around the world who would gladly kill their neighbors to slightly improve their own situation, and tell these people that they should remove all their selfish thoughts and band together for the "greater good"??Maybe in a few hundred years, when humans have evolved into more advanced, sophisticated beings, the idea of us all being able to unite together in a positive global cause will be more realistic. But we are far from that right now. Don't get me wrong, communism was a good idea in theory... I don't think that Karl Marx would have got as much attention as he did if it WASN'T an interesting idea... Heck, I wear a Che Guevera shirt to school sometimes...  But back to the topic... how can you say that it worked in Russia? I would say that any system of government that led to the deaths of millions of their own citizens was not successful. Yes, the purges. I know that most of that was due to a cruel and innefective leader, but how about the violent crushings of the so-called Hungarian and Czechoslovakian "uprisings" During the 1950's and 1960's? Now, many say that just because it didn't work in Russia may not mean it won't work anywhere else. True, but lets be honest- taking a look at all the communist nations of the world, past and present, the track record of communism doesn't look too good. Those are the problems I have with communism. If someone can figure out solutions, I would love to hear them. Oh yeah, by the way. I would not say that Canada is "Almost entirely socialist". We have publicly funded healthcare and education systems, but we employ most every aspect of the market economy in some form or another. Canada (in general) believes in free trade, the benefit of business development, and the idea that there are people who will always have more than others. Really, Canada believes in most of the basic fundamental principles that the United States do. I think most of us would like to think that we implement them better, though, and use ideas from other countries to complement them. France in general is a MUCH more socialist country than Canada. Just my 2.38 CDN cents. 
|
|
|
|
| Post Number: 29
|
|
|
| Post Number: 30
|
|
|
|
|
|
